passion...

[nwinn]

I consider myself a 'neutralist,' I don't believe that any of it is right but I don't believe that any of it is wrong either so, I didn't think I'd watch this movie. It was interesting though, it really conveys the passion that religious people must feel for Jesus because of what they believe he went through for them. Some who view religion similarly to me may actually be interested, though.

So, this movie was produced and directed by Mel Gibson and if you've read anything about it the two things you've definitely seen are that it is being criticized for being so violent and that it would never have made it to the theatres without Mel Gibson's name on it.

It is absolutely the most violent movie I think I've ever seen. I thought that Gladiator and Hannibal were both really graphic, this movie is at least 10x more so than either. And, I thought the actors were good but, I'm not sure how far this movie would've gotten without Mel, I mean it's a pretty controversial subject and I doubt the funding would've been there without his name.

Oh, and it's completely subtitled.

[Kirynos]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure that it's spoken in Aramaic, or some similarly pronounced language of that time.
I'm interested in how the names are pronounced, most especially.

[Yini]

I read that the movie was done in Latin, which of course I can only speak and understand a few words..which i'm sure none of are spoken in the movie. If I were to watch i'm gald they have subtitled lol. Canare knows more about latin then I do as he took an extra year.

Yini

[nwinn]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure that it's spoken in Aramic, or some similarly pronounced language of that time.
I'm interested in how the names are pronounced, most especially.Yah, Aramaic and Latin. Jesus sounded like Yeshwa I think and Peter was something like Kefa... I can't remember how they pronounced the rest, sorry. :|

[Zarxen]

Roger Ebert is quoted somewhere as saying that it is the most violent movie ever made. I might check it out this weekend.

[Tarissa]

This absolutely the most violent movie made bullshit is ridiculous. It is a construct of context, and if people think that the story of jesus has him pinned up on a roman cross with flowers and dafodils, they're going to be a bit mistaken.

[Qaediin]

Thats what i am saying Tarissa. Main stream christians think there was music and just soft crying. No beatings or floggings etc. I havent seen the movie yet but from what i read that would probably be a close reality to what happened to Jesus*if you believe in such* than what has been published or made into movies.

Just watching how some of the Christians and Jewish faith people are responding to the movie is ridiculous. I had an arguement with my mother in law about this movie. She said pretty much the same things all other christians are saying. So i asked her if someone walked up to your door and told you he was the Son of God or Jesus would you follow him or call the cops? She had no response but to say well thats different. That from a 55 year Lutheran woman>_<.

[Kirynos]

Diane Sawyer vs. Mel Gibson... that was pure comedy, not an interview.

That's what I was hoping to hear, Nwinn. I think they used Adonai though, so thumbs down, there.

[nwinn]

This absolutely the most violent movie made bullshit is ridiculous. It is a construct of context, and if people think that the story of jesus has him pinned up on a roman cross with flowers and dafodils, they're going to be a bit mistaken.I don't want to explain too much but, the injuries he sustained were so horrible that even just the sound effects would've been enough to give me an idea of what was happening, I didn't need to see the tools that they whip him with stick into his back and tear away the skin revealing 2 of his ribs. That was pretty gross. :|

So, really... my opinion of how violent it was wasn't based at all on what the storybook version is but, purely on what was necessary to be shown in order for their point that he was brutally beaten to get across to audiences.

[Zappo]

i may see that movie, i mean... after all my people got Jesus damn good!
ps-- dont come after me with wepons

[Tarissa]

I don't want to explain too much but, the injuries he sustained were so horrible that even just the sound effects would've been enough to give me an idea of what was happening, I didn't need to see the tools that they whip him with stick into his back and tear away the skin revealing 2 of his ribs. That was pretty gross. :|

I guess I just don't understand that, in a fictional context violence is entertainment, but when it is depicted about something important, such as the story of the final days of jesus christ, then it is over-the-top and disgusting. Shouldn't we respect violence even more when it shows us what happened during something that is the basis of the christian religion?

I guess I feel that "eww gross" shouldn't be the first reaction when people witness the torture and execution of the man who christians believe is the son of god, who saved them from eternal damnation.

Also, I am an atheist with agnostic tendencies :D

[nwinn]

I guess I just don't understand that, in a fictional context violence is entertainment, but when it is depicted about something important, such as the story of the final days of jesus christ, then it is over-the-top and disgusting.
I thought the other two movies I mentioned were too graphic, I was just using them as a comparison. I wasn't saying that the violence in them was ok and this wasn't b/c of who the story is about, Hannibal was especially disgusting but most of those parts were very dark and your imagination fills in the voids... you see just about every wound inflicted on Jesus in Passion and it's not necessary... it becomes more of a stunt than just telling the story. :|

[Myztlee]

Thank God for Zappo.

[Buazag Bonesteel]

I'll probably see this somewhere along the line just to see if I can find any obvious flaws. I find religion fascinating myself....I just don't see how any reasonably intelligent person can take it seriously is all ;)

So far the best part of this movie for me was the few minutes I caught of Dennis Miller talking with gloria Allred. She was talking about how dangerous this movie was and that it depicted things the wrong way (because the Pope said so). Hey....everyon'e entitled to their own opinion right? But the funny part was that she admitted a few minutes later that she HADN'T seen the movie yet. I'd say that the biggest proof that there isn't a God in the sense that most religions would have us believe, is that so far he hasn't just nuked all us idiots and started over.

[nwinn]

lol buaz, right on! ;)

[Eomer]

The movie wouldn't have been made w/o Mel Gibson not because of his influence, but because he funded it entirely on his own, to the tune of 30 million. Because it was self-funded, they just went with some relatively small distributor (not like they needed much promotion either, with all the controversy), and they will only get a small cut. Mel Gibson is going to make a damn killing off the movie. I am not sure if he has pledged that the money go to some charity or cause, but I would be pretty surprised if he just took the money and ran. It made something like 20-25 million the first day alone.

I haven't seen it yet, and don't really plan to. From what I have heard about the violence, I don't really see much point in going to see it. I was raised a roman catholic, but left that behind years ago, and from what I have heard and read about the violence, they movie is just not something I would bother seeing. If it covered more of Jesus' life, or focused more on his teaching etc, and not simply on his sacrifice, I might be more tempted to go.

Oh yeah and last, Mel Gibson is a religious zealot, and one of the reasons that there was a lot of controvery over the movie is that the sect or whatever that be belongs to rejects several of the Vatican decisions from the past half century, and one of the important parts of that was the Church declared that Jews were not responsible for the death of Christ. So some people felt that the movie was anti-semitic, more based on Gibson's beliefs than the movie content.

[Tarissa]

I can't get over the fact that if a movie is fiction, than it is violent, but doesn't stir controversy, but when you put it in the context of THE ROOT OF YOUR EXISTENCE than it becomes OMGSOVIOLENT.

I don't even profess to those views, but it's another instance when I don't understand human nature.

Regarding the nature of "most Christians", that is another byproduct of humanity. Include a relatively large proportion of people in a category, and it is almost scientifically proven that most of them are going to be foundationless idiots.

Wow, such angst.

[Zarxen]

I haven't seen it yet, and don't really plan to. From what I have heard about the violence, I don't really see much point in going to see it. I was raised a roman catholic, but left that behind years ago, and from what I have heard and read about the violence, they movie is just not something I would bother seeing. If it covered more of Jesus' life, or focused more on his teaching etc, and not simply on his sacrifice, I might be more tempted to go.

I was thinking about seeing it yesterday then I changed my mind as wasn't in the mood for that kind of violence. Is it gratuitious violence or is it violence that does serve and fit the themes of the movie? I think both sides have been argued on many message boards. As I haven't seen the movie I can't say, yet it's not something that would stop me from seeing the movie. I have sit through Irreversible on more then one occasion and I consider it to be a movie that has the most violent scenes ever put on celluloid(interesting that Monica Belluci is also in it), but then again it's a type of violence that you have have your mindset for the occasion. I don't know if the Passion fits that style of violence but it's an impression I have gotten from more then several people.

[Eomer]

I can't get over the fact that if a movie is fiction, than it is violent, but doesn't stir controversy, but when you put it in the context of THE ROOT OF YOUR EXISTENCE than it becomes OMGSOVIOLENT.

Well, first of all, the violence isn't the main reason why I don't plan on seeing it really. Like I said, I would see it if it focused more on Christ's life and teachings etc, than the last 12 hours of his life. It misses the point of Christ, IMO.

And there are different kinds of violence. A movie like, say, Equilibrium is extremely violent, with probably hundreds of people being killed (they don't show the puppies getting shot, though, which I always find funny). But it's a totally different kind of violence than what is in The Passion. Kill Bill is also incredibly violent, again with hundreds of people dieing. But it's almost cartoon violence, in the amount of blood being spewed. It's not realistic at all. I just think they are totally different.

And I don't much have a problem with the violence in The Passion. They can show what they want, as far as I am concerned. I just think that the movie missed the point, and Mel Gibson chose to focus on the wrong part of Christ's life.

[Zarxen]

And there are different kinds of violence. A movie like, say, Equilibrium is extremely violent, with probably hundreds of people being killed (they don't show the puppies getting shot, though, which I always find funny). But it's a totally different kind of violence than what is in The Passion. Kill Bill is also incredibly violent, again with hundreds of people dieing. But it's almost cartoon violence, in the amount of blood being spewed. It's not realistic at all. I just think they are totally different.

I was going to say something along those lines. Kill Bill or something like Dawn of the Dead or Freddie Versus Jason is a type of Violence that doesn't make me uncomfortable as it's a type of cartoon violence. Irreversible, Straw Dogs( to some degree) and possibly the Passion is something that is more difficult to view as to the type of violence.

[Maegwin]

I'd say that the biggest proof that there isn't a God in the sense that most religions would have us believe, is that so far he hasn't just nuked all us idiots and started over.
He did once, and promised never to do it again...seen any rainbows lately?

[Myztlee]

I'd say that the biggest proof that there isn't a God in the sense that most religions would have us believe, is that so far he hasn't just nuked all us idiots and started over.

Tell that to the dinosaurs.

[Buazag Bonesteel]

It misses the point of Christ, IMO.


Aaaaand bingo....therein lies the problem. What the hell was the point of Christ and why do so many people feel that not only do they know the answer to that, but are willing to go to such extreme measures to defend it??

I always get a chuckle when anyone professes to KNOW anything about "God"(and religion really has very little to do with God) I think that on the whole, we all need to get just a bit more comfortable with not knowing some things. I'm one curious sumbitch. I love searching for answers.....but sometimes they just aren't there. That doesn't mean I should make them up though. You make up the answer to something, say it really convincingly, talk a lot of people into believing it, and suddenly it becomes "the truth," or just another reason for one group of people to judge another. Personally I can do without that. But hey.....I won't judge ;)

[Buazag Bonesteel]

He did once, and promised never to do it again...seen any rainbows lately?


Oh yeah....the Noah thing. If that happened exactly the way the book said it did then I'd like to kick Noah's ass for letting mosquitos on the boat.

Asisde from that I think the whole thing was highly unfair. The great flood and all was first testament. Moses didn't get the set of rules to post in the break room until 2nd testament. So the big G flooded the place and killed a bunch of people who didn't know what the rules were yet.

Of course now we have the rules.....so yeah I'd say our days are numbered :(

[Ubar]

I saw this, it was good, damn good. But it is very violent and gorey, it makes sense in the context but there were still several parts that made me cringe, it was very gruesome.

[Phaera]

Surprised I haven't heard this phrase yet..but you knew it was coming:

"It opens your eyes.."

I liked the movie's concept, but yeah, the gore was a bit much. It's certainly an eye popper. And hey Ubie.

[Ubar]

Hi Phaera =D

[Eomer]

Aaaaand bingo....therein lies the problem. What the hell was the point of Christ and why do so many people feel that not only do they know the answer to that, but are willing to go to such extreme measures to defend it??

First of all, let me start by saying that I don't actively believe in god at this point. So I am not trying to profess some belief system. I think that Christ was probably a real historical figure, although probably not the Christ that is portrayed in the bible. I just think, in my honest opinion, that focusing on only 12 hours of Christ's life is short sighted and misses the point. My opinion.

And I ask myself the same question, at least the extreme part. I can understand people wanting to find meaning in their lives through the Bible/Christ/whatever, I don't personally agree with it, but I can at least respect someone's faith. But it always boggles my mind when you come across people that are SO set in their beliefs, any other viewpoint is completely irrelevant and useless to them.

[nwinn]

I can't get over the fact that if a movie is fiction, than it is violent, but doesn't stir controversy, but when you put it in the context of THE ROOT OF YOUR EXISTENCE than it becomes OMGSOVIOLENT. I don't watch TV very much and read very little news... msn when I sign out of hotmail some times... So, I don't know where you're getting that from really. ><

If any of you who don't understand why I say it is unnecessary violence saw the parts where Jesus is beaten, I believe you'd agree that it is not necessary to see every second of it in order to understand how much physical pain he was supposed to have suffered.

I think the major reason why the violence is controversial has to do with not who the movie is about but, who the audience is meant to be... it isn't a teen slasher with some half-naked cheerleaders, sorry I just ruined that surprise for you boys.

[BurnemWizfyre]

Religion in itself isnt bad Imo, but then you have morons that see money to be made from it, a way to control people, and a way to limit what can and cant be seen/heard.
Organized Religion has been corrupt since DAY 1 and Catholics by far are the most guilty of this, though ALL religions are very much guilty.

The whole Catholic religion has rubbed me the wrong way since i could remember, Normally id just not give a shit what religion does what but the catholic religion seems to sticks its nose in places it dont belong, mine and others business that dont belong to thier religion. You know what, if i want to hear a song with fuck, bitch, whore, slut, i should have every right to hear it w/out the catholic religion butting in telling me whats moral and whats not. If i have to hear the catholics screaming "think of the children" ever again after theyve paid MILLIONS of dollars in law suits over thier priest molesting children i think im going to puke at the sheer hipocracy of it all. Then the fanatics that go to abortion clinics and TAKE the very thing they are trying to SAVE. Let people burn in hell if such a place exist for the actions they do, remember even though catholics tend to weave "thou shalt not kill" into "thou shall not kill, unless you believe in a different invisble man then us" dont give them the right to take lifes, specially when they are claiming to be there to save lives of those un-born. Sorry im ranting but catholics just always rubbed me the wrong way :(

Basically, do your own thing. I dont care if your religion believes david blaine is the new son of christ sent to teach us lifes secrets in the form of magic while having sex with 10 foot tall space aliens, keep it to yourself and keep it the fuck out of my life.

Religion to an extent is ok, if you dont take every single word in the bible and believe it all to be true and live by it, then its ok imo. The bible and the basis around religion is a very good moral standard to TRY and live by, we are not perfect and i do not think god expects us to be. You will not see me in church ever, does it mean im a heathen, depends on which religon you belong to i suppose, i have faith theres a god and i try to live a very moral life, though at times i fail and times i dont. You can choose to not have faith or have faith, i know this sounds fucked up but what do you have to lose if you do have faith and try and live a moral life to the best of your abilities and asked to be forgiven for your faults, nothing.

P.S----if you think i hate you cause your catholic, then think again---i dislike your religion not you because of your religion.

P.P.S----If anything i said about the catholic religion has offended you, then i truely and sincerely appologize for everything the catholic religion has done, as it is clearly my fault for pointing out thier faults voiding thier actual actions.

[Elidroth]

OK.. this is going to be a bit random.. cause there's a lot to respond to..

1) People coming out of theaters claiming 'This is the way it really was.' How the fuck do they know THIS is the truth? They weren't there. It MIGHT be this bad.. then again.. it might not. All we have are a few paragraphs written about events 2000 years ago.

2) Taking the bible literally. Huh? If I tell my friends a story, by next week it'll be different, embellished, etc. Now extrapolate that out to 1200 years after Christ's life (about the time the King James Bible was written if I recall correctly). Think it'll still be the same story?

3) Religion. Organized religion has been the cause of more pain, misery, and death than anything else in recorded history. To me it just seems like a mechanism to control people via guilt and fear all the while making a buck. And for anyone to condemn my personal choices which affect nobody but myself all the while they're molesting children simply is beyond comprehension. Current admitted totals by the Catholic Church are over 11,000 cases of molestation. But you're going to point fingers?

I don't care personally if you believe your pet cocker spaniel is the messiah, or if you believe your god to be hiding behind an incoming comet. Cool.. knock yourself out man.. but don't try to inflict YOUR beliefs on me. This whole world would be a lot less stressed out if people would just mind their own fucking business.

[Eomer]

Yeah, that's one of the things that bugs me the most about Jesus and the Bible. People take it so literally, and claim that the four gospels are the perfect retelling of Christ's life. But in reality they were all written something like 30-100 years after he died, by people who weren't even there, basically writing down oral histories. So how accurate can they be?

Not to mention, there are something like at least 40-60 other gospels written about Christ's life that the Catholic church suppressed, most likely because these other ones didn't match up with the Church's view of Christ, or the message they wanted to get across. Several indicated that Mary Magdalene and Jesus were in fact married, and possibly had children, for example. I have been meaning to pick up a book about this, I think The Davinci Code is one book that talks about it.

[Buazag Bonesteel]

Judging by some of the responses in this thread.....of which I agree with in large part......video game players are the smartest motherfuckers on the planet. Now if only there was some way to make everyone else agree with us :p

[Maegwin]

Judging by some of the responses in this thread.....of which I agree with in large part......video game players are the smartest motherfuckers on the planet. Now if only there was some way to make everyone else agree with us :p
New Religion! MMORPGianity! Woot! :p :p