Proposed: If Naggy is up 2 days, Ragefire goes to guild who kills Naggy

Three weeks since Ragefire killed according to the rotation. Even with patches, that is too long. Unless there have been some really exceptional extraneous circumstances (haven't seen any), this is a waste.

My impression is that the problem is that Naggy isn't dropping. People need a motivation to get him dead.

Proposed addition to rotation rules:
If Naggy stays up for two full days, whichever guild organizes a successful Naggy raid automatically gets the next Ragefire, unless a patch puts up a new Naggy before Ragefire spawns.

Reasons for this:
The guild that actually took care of Naggy should be rewarded.
Having guilds just rely on their spot in rotation, without taking a pass or take action to get Ragefire spawned, causes the entire rotation to potentially grind to a halt.
By making sure people are motivated to kill Naggy, there will be more Zordak spawns - everybody benefits.

Yes? No?

This is fine with me.

I think whoever is up in the rotation order should take it upon themseves to get Nagafen dead.

This doesn't mean Nagafen has to be done in-guild, btw. It's not that hard to organize an impromptu raid. Just offer the loot to the out-of-guild folks who help.

Anyway, put Mythic down as a yes.

This sounds resonable to me, but I'll let Dlgoth give a yea or nay for L`Malla. We've got to do something to get the zordak rotation going again.

I do see some potental for abuse of this rule though. If guild X is up for Zordak, and assists/organizes a naggy raid. Should they get a free incentive zordak and then their normal rotation zordak? And who is to say that guild X had an active enough part in a naggy pickup raid, what if more than one guild is assisting?

I might suggest instead, if naggy is up for 2 days the guild who's turn it is for ragefire must take a pass. But that could still lead to long delays in the killing of ragefire, maybe the rotation should skip to the guild who kills him and proceed normally from there.

Just thowing out some ideas here.

I would actually consider changing this a bit:

If it is YOUR turn for Ragefire and Nagafen is left up longer than 2-3 days (or whatever the rest of you feel reasonable), you pass on your Ragefire turn. That will definately give the guild who is up for Rage incentive to get him dead, while giving some of the lower levelled guilds still a fair shot to do their Nagafen raids without having him constantly plowed over by high-end guilds.

Obviously, instances where Nag spawns and a patch is scheduled 1-2 days later could be treated differently.

Thoughts?

I know I havent been haunting the IGB area for as long as some of you have. But didn't we at one time have a sort of standing agreement that if Rage popped and the guild up for him didnt have enough ppl on, other guilds should help them if necessary? Why not do this for Naggy also? Between all of the IGB guilds we just may have enough twinks who can do it.

Not really sure how I feel about the 2 day thing...seems to be lots of room for abuse, but we all seem to have done admirably working out any conflicts/disagreements so far...so I'd say NI is willing to go along with it :D

We already actually allow anybody to get help from Naggy - several of us have posted here already saying just give us a call and we will pull out twinks. Unfortunately, that hasn't worked - which is why I propose these somewhat stronger measures.

I like your idea Sirensa.

1) It's fair to the low-level guilds.

2) It's fair to the other members on the IGB, waiting in line.

3) It's harder to abuse. (I can see how "passing" by successive guilds could cause problems, but I really think the pressure from the Clerics in the guild, and the responsibility of guild leaders to their members would keep this to a minimum.)

I think we should go with this. The only question is how many days should Nagafen live.

I personally think 2 days is long enough, given the huge backlog of Cleric epics there must be on the server.

Baramos

Sirensa's alternative is good enough for me - I'll support it as long as we get something in place soon.

Two days is enough. Organizing impromptu Naggy raids is not terribly hard imho, and any guild on the IGB should be able to provide plenty of high level buff casters, etc.

Eh well, I guess I'm pushed out byt he majority, but I don't like that idea personally. The idea that naggy must be dead in the first place is really really stupid, but especially for a smaller guild like us where everyone is basically 60, and twinks are 58+ for the most part, this is basically saying we can't have a patch-spawn ragefire. I personally don't know many people outside the guild, those I do are well over 52, and same with the most of the others in the guild.

So basically, we'd have to watch the rotation go by until a) a group gets together to kill it right as our turn comes around or b) be after someone else that is forced to kill naggy for their ragefire, and no respawn of naggy occurs.

Re: Inizen's comments -

It is still in everyone's best interest to help make sure Nagafen is down asap in all instances. The biggest problem here seems to be someone saying "ok - we're heading in at X time - need help". Everyone here has people willing to help, just need something in place to force that coordination.

The clerics of our server are in a unique position really as getting a cleric an epic weapon helps not only their guild, but members of other guilds throughout the server. I know I have rezzed people from every guild on this IGB and been rezzed by people from about every guild on this IGB.

All other differences aside, the more cleric epics around, the easier it is for everyone to get rezzed when needed.


Re: Nagafen Spawn timing.

Two days seems fair. If he spawns early enough on a Monday, then leave Monday + Tuesday for lower guilds to give him a try. If he is still up on Wednesday it is the guild up in the rotation's turn to make sure Nag dies that day or they lose their spot. On Thursday, the next guild in line is responsible for Nag dying, etc. If he spawns late on Monday, then that would leave Tuesday and Wednesday for lower guilds to try Nag, Thursday would be the rotation guild's responsibility.


Thoughts?

Inizen,

I think you underestimate the power of newbie greed and the Vindi name. I am quite confident that if Vidication posted on the druzzil ro boards that they were holding an open Naggy raid, with loot rules that gives all the loot to the 52 and below that show up, and then had Vindi's present to buff people, that a horde of level 52 and below would show up and kill Naggy for you. You could probably even work something out with some of the people who hold open raids already such as Macchan or Xorshaik, or team up with a lower level, non-IGB guild such as Ardent Spirit that still does Naggy.

It is a pain in the ass to organize such raids, particularly as a bunch of the people who show up are newbies to raids and not very good at taking direction, but you guys would get your Ragefire, which is well worth the cost of losing two or three hours to get an open raid on Naggy done, imho.

Inizen, if you have trouble getting peeps to kill naggy or do not want the hassel of an open raid... TR has enough 52 and under alts and mains from our Valiant Legion merger to do Naggy in house. Just give me a holler if needed I would like to see the Rage rotation move along much faster and will offer the combined effort of all TR to make that happen if need be.

I'll go along with Sirensa's idea.

Naggy up for 48 hours(?) = pass

Does this disscussion turn to offically ? I would like see that if so.

I agree with Ahaman.

I move that Mystari add this to the rotation guildlines as follows:

Ragefire Auto-Pass It is the responsibility of the guild up for Ragefire in the IGB rotation to drop Nagafen. If Nagafen is up for two continuous days, with no patches occurring during those two days, then the guild that is up automatically takes a pass on Ragefire for their spot in the rotation. The next guild in the rotation then has two days to kill Nagafen before they auto-pass, etc.

Let's have Quint add this rule (in Sirensa's form) to the rotation list.

Any objections?

If none by tomorrow, let's tag it on.

Baramos